Mobility Innovators

Jaspal Singh [00:04]:

Welcome to the mobility innovators podcast.

Jaspal Singh [00:10]:

Hello, everyone. I am so happy to welcome all listeners from around the world to the Mobility Innovators Podcasts. I am your host, Jaspal Singh. Mobility Innovators Podcast invites key innovators in the transportation and logistics sector to share their thought about the key changes in the sector, about their work, and what is their forecast for the future.

Today, I will be talking about two of my favorite topics – technology and angel investment. A today guest is a real hustler. She is a Founder and General Partner of Flucas Venture based in West Palm beach, Florida. She has built a certificate of around 3000 angel investors, who has invested in more than 280 startups. She is a graduate of Duke University and Harvard Law School, and also serves as a partner at Jupiter, a Florida-based real estate finance fund with $3 billion in asset management. I am so happy to welcome Ashley Flucas, Founder and General Partner, Flucas Ventures. Before starting this episode, I would like to share a few general definition for the audience.

Jaspal Singh [01:14]:

An angel investor also known as a private investor seed investor or angel funder is a high-net-worth individual who provides financial backing for small startups or entrepreneurs. Typically, in exchange for ownership equity in the company.

Venture capital is a form of private equity financing that is provided by a venture capital fund or a fund to a startup early-stage or emerging company that has been deemed to have high growth potential, or which has demonstrated high growth.

An investment thesis is a strategy by which a venture capital fund makes money for the fund investor. Now it’s time to listen and learn.

 

Hello Ashley. Thank you so much for joining us on this show. I’m really looking forward to our conversation today.

Ashley L. Flucas [02:03]:

Thank you. Thank you for having me.

Jaspal Singh [02:05]:

So today I’ll be spending time getting to know more about you about Flucas Ventures, your journey as an angel investor, and your thought on the key trend in the private funding market.

To begin with, I would like you to share with our listener a little bit about yourself and also, are there any interesting fact about your career that are not on LinkedIn?

Ashley L. Flucas [02:26]:

Sure. happy to do it though. I think I’m a pretty open book. So my background I started my career as a capital markets lawyer. I guess maybe the one factoid that’s not on there, but maybe is becoming more apparent is, I never actually really wanted to be a lawyer. It was kind of one of those things where I felt like I was a political science major and, and felt like I would have a reasonable aptitude for it. And I also felt like you know, there’s a pretty good path of lawyers going on to do other things within businesses. And then though, like I could at least kind of be in the rooms with the, with different types of deal-making until I could kind of stumble on stumble on what my thing was.

Ashley L. Flucas [03:11]:

So I first started out working in in Europe, mostly underwriter side work and, debt in the capital markets then came back to the states where I did mostly issuer side work and you know, public offerings and SEC reporting and that kind of thing. And then eight years ago, I ended up joining the group where I still am now as a partner. So, we have a real estate development arm we own and operate some different assets – sports arena, mixed-use properties, entertainment and then we have a commercial real estate focus fund as well. I started getting active angel investment about 4 years ago. At first, it just started out investing my own money and a way of diversifying, trying to figure out ways to build wealth, and then became an obsession and it seemingly escalated ever since and about, you know, halfway through the journey.

Ashley L. Flucas [04:16]:

So coming up around two years ago I just started, I decided to start investing via SPVs AKA forming, a Syndicate, which I run on the AngelList platform, which is how I met your host. And so in the July will be two years and in that time have built the syndicate membership up to about almost 3,500 folks distributed all around the world and have deployed around $80 million into a wide variety of startups also across the globe across all sectors and stages. Yeah. And geographies. So it’s been quite a ride and you know, as we’ll get into I’ve seen a bit of the boom times, especially last year with the way things were going with valuations and, exits and now you know, apparently winter is coming.

Ashley L. Flucas [05:13]:

So it’s an interesting time to be in the space. You know, I don’t know that I necessarily have a unique perspective on where we are, but I think having my background coming from law, coming from real estate, coming from working in a business where you have to earn money day one to keep the lights on, and there’s no one coming in to save the day. I think I’m not as afraid as other folks and, you know, my whole philosophy is, you know, kind of the most opportunity is in these times of trouble. So, you know, I’m actually pretty excited because you know, companies we’d never heard of before are going to come out of all of this and kind of be the next household name. So it’s about being in the game to be able to take advantage of that.

Jaspal Singh [06:02]:

Yeah,  that’s a great point. You mentioned that this winter will bring new more companies. So Airbnb, and Uber there are a lot more companies that came from the last recession. So we probably see a new one coming up and, you rightly mentioned you started your career as a lawyer. So I, I put a quote like a lawyer by the day and I invested at the night. So you’re working day and night on both of your passion.

So you are a solo VC and leading your own AngelList syndicate, which you just mentioned, and you’re managing the whole process yourself, which helped to make investment decisions quicker, but at the same time, put a lot of work and a lot of pressure on you because you need to conduct a due diligence process and write investment memos and all.

So, can you share how this deal process and syndicate actually work? And let’s say you meet a founder, and you want to invest in a company, what are the key steps to be followed? And how long does this entire process take?

Ashley L. Flucas [06:58]:

Yeah. So, I mean, hopefully in this realm, the more you do it, the more efficient you become. And so, you know, what the process looked like two years ago versus what it looks like now are a little different they’ll I’m sure they’ll be like most folks going through another bit of point of having to adapt and involved in adjusting to kind of where the macroeconomic situation is. But, you know, basically I meet a founder you know, obviously have kind of have my initial call. We’ll get, you know, initial data room, things like that. And then, you know, one benefit for me for, from having that legal background is, you know, diligence is something that I was trained to do trained to do. So, for me as a solo VC, I guess it maybe come a bit easier than most. When I started out, particularly as a junior lawyer, you know, put together data rooms, reviewed all the documents in data rooms, synthesized all that elevated issues, etc.

Ashley L. Flucas [08:02]:

So for me that comes a bit second nature. And, you know, one of the benefits about you know, the networking that I’ve been able to accomplish in different, you know, communities within this startup ecosystem, I’ve been able to be a part of. And, the members of the syndicate is that in. It may be a solo VC, but I’m not alone. Right. So if I have things that are kind of out of my core competency, but I think are really interesting, I kind of have go-to people that I can go to, who I trust who can be a second set of eyes, whether it’s technical diligence, whether it’s market diligence, or even kind of like geographic specific stuff. So, for example, if I invest a in LATAM and India, places like that.

Ashley L. Flucas [08:50]:

And I have specific folks who I have robust portfolios, or who are there on the ground and can give me a sense check beyond just my own kind of intuition. And, then what I’m reading in diligence. So that’s kind of my process. And then from meeting the founder you know, all the way through the investment and diligence process. I mean, I ideally that’s like a two to three week kind of end-to-end process now because just you know, just getting more efficient in terms of knowing what I’m looking for and from a diligence perspective, knowing what my resources are and knowing, you know when I go out to LPs, you know, the kind of notes that I wan to hit and what resonates, and again, same thing with memos and messages and things like that, just getting a lot of reference in just makes you more efficient, being able  to deal with it and, have the faster speed of execution, which in a bull market that was really necessary, because frankly, you know, in those bull markets, sometimes you might have 10 days to do everything.

Ashley L. Flucas [10:01]:

Whereas now I actually expect the timeline will be much longer. So it won’t be that same rush, but it was definitely good. Good practice for me getting everything in order.

Jaspal Singh [10:16]:

That’s pretty fast, two to three week is pretty fast. In fact, I remember I spoke to a couple of founders you invested, and they told me that you complete things very fast and you are very efficient and all. In fact, there is an old saying which say that you can’t hide anything from your doctor and your lawyer. So I think founder cannot hide anything from you.

So now a little bit about your portfolio, and you mentioned that already, that you invested in so many companies around the world. In fact, when I did the last count, it was 282 companies in last four years, which is phenomenal, and you have already exited more than 10 companies. So, what is your thesis and what are your investment strategy? And also, if you can share a little more about like how the angel investors are different than the venture capital firm?

Ashley L. Flucas [11:03]:

Yeah. So if I missed any part of that, please feel free to follow up. So, you know, I am very much a generalist and I like to say an opportunist. And so because I’ve kind of cultivated those relationships in terms of geography, discipline, etc. Any deal that, that looks potentially credible, interesting that has the potential to be some, a category kind of defining opportunity is something. That I’m going to take a serious look at. So I’m very open and I don’t close the door on most things. And for me, you know, going into angel investing, I had a similar mindset to you know, public investing, even things that I do even in real estate. The number one word is, you know, diversity. When you are in angel investment, you know, they there’s this thought of don’t spread and play or whatever they say. But I was like, you know, I think that’s a bit snooty.

Ashley L. Flucas [12:05]:

I would agree with that, but to me there is a difference between that and indexing. And so what I’ve always wanted to do is index. And for me, I have kind of now I’m experiencing two events through that strategy. It’s worked well first being, you know, I started investing whatever 2018 was the shock of COVID. And now going into 2022, this shock and my portfolio has held up remarkably well over that time, I think because of that diversification and no matter how smarter expert you think you maybe. We’re all pretending to be normal time is here. And so I think the key line of defense is being diversified. And for me, that means being multi-sector, multi-stage and then hedging a bit outside of the USA as well. So again, like I said, my strategy is just you know, really keying in on like I said, those potentially category defining opportunities.

Ashley L. Flucas [13:08]:

And, and I think as I’ve said in many interviews, the reason I can take, I won’t say an agnostic approach, but where I can, I guess be generalist in that way is because I primarily evaluate startups outside of like  biotech and deep tech, which are bit different based on distribution. I think if you strip away AKA Product-Market-Fit, AKA Sales, whatever you want to say it, I think most startups, if you strip away a lot of things, including the product itself and you really focus on that you’re kind of, you’re going to get into a lot of potentially successful companies, because at the end of the day you may be enamored with a product, but if you don’t have a team and a strategy, that’s going to be able to get that into the hand of the end user.

Ashley L. Flucas [13:57]:

You have nothing. And similarly, I’ve seen plenty of deals where the product is kind of mediocre, but they’re brilliant on their Go to Market and there’s a big outcome. So for me, that’s been you know, been my kind of north star. And then for me, it makes it interesting. Right. It’s like, I get to like, you know, so cool like day to day you know, it’s a learning process for me. Like I get to learn about so many different companies and, verticals and all of that with that said, I mean I do from looking at my own portfolio, we’ll say though that I do probably gravitate more towards certain areas. And that’s probably just because of my background. So like, I have like a ton of FinTech you know, a ton of companies outside of the US.

Ashley L. Flucas [14:51]:

I mean, it’s still like 80-20, 80% in the US, but I think having an international background, having a capital package background probably drives a bit of that. But beyond that, I’m pretty open.

There was a second part to your question of it was the difference between angels and, and VC. Yeah. It’s interesting because as like, as an angel or I don’t even know what the right word is, because like I said, I invest late stage as well, secondaries even, but, you know, I’m you know, you don’t have some disadvantages relative to VCs in terms of obviously just the sheer cheque size. You know, being able to necessarily capture the market in the same way that they have and establish the kind of same in inbound that kind of thing and branding.

Ashley L. Flucas [15:43]:

But then I also think that you have, there are ways to kind of overcome that. And then there are a lot of, you know, advantages as well. So, you know, even if you’re an angel or solo VC, it behooves you to be a part of different communities and networks. So you can leverage that and collectively, you know, have a reach and insight that I don’t know if you’ll be on par with the, the big VCs, but you’ll be able to do some damage. And you can also do a lot to build your own brand and, get that top of funnel. But then you’re also untethered in some pretty cool ways, right? And that if you’re solo VC or angel. You are the boss, you’re judge, jury, and executioner. If you especially as a personal angel, if you’re not managing other people’s money, if you talk to somebody in 20 minutes and you want to invest, that’s your prerogative, you don’t need to go through bureaucracy or committees, or only be limited to making X type of investments or unable to make investments outside of a certain mandate.

Ashley L. Flucas [16:47]:

So that kind of I think autonomy is pretty powerful, especially if you fall an approach like I do in terms of the indexing. And then the other thing is also a bit on the economics, right? So I know what I’m seeing now and what I saw during COVID, which was like a great opportunity for me investing was that, you know, when these shock events happened, a lot of VCs sit back and they lick their wounds and they assess when you’re an angel or solo VC or syndicate. You can just go and, take advantage of opportunities, take advantage of bargains. And at the end of the day of course you want to support your portfolio companies, all of that good stuff, but you know, your investments each stand on their own. And so you can keep going, you can keep going, or you don’t have to worry about man.

Ashley L. Flucas [17:41]:

I had this really great company, but these nine others are horrible and it’s weighing things down. And how do I balance that? And then you don’t have other constraints, like for example target ownership, etc. Like if I want to go and invest in a company and they can only make room for X dollars, that’s fine because I don’t need to own 10%, 5%, whatever it is. If it’s a really great company that I believe in, I just need to get in. And so that’s a lower threshold to clear and same thing, like no such thing as like competing term sheets and all of that, they can make room because of that flexibility. If you can prove the other components of your value add.

Jaspal Singh [18:24]:

And that’s all our great point, like you mentioned, You can be the king in your own kingdom. So you build your own kingdom and, and run it. You don’t need to depend on external LPs. You don’t need to answer them.

And also, I really like your approach about indexing. I didn’t realize that, like you are balancing all these portfolio companies in a way that it makes an index. So, if there is a recession there should not be too much of downfall. If there is a too much of booming market, it should be moderated, should not be too high because that’s also not good sign. Like that’s what happened in the bull market. So actually follow up on my previous question.

And like you mentioned, you are a sector and geography agnostic which mean you’re investing in all sector, and you mentioned that 80% of your companies are in US, but 20% are outside.

Jaspal Singh [19:10]:

FinTech and biotech, you are liking that space. And in fact, I saw like largest holding you have is in FinTech. So I can see that. But at the same time, you invested in mobility companies. So there are 10 companies in mobility sector, and there are 13 companies in the logistic sector in your portfolio.

I have two questions.

• So how do you assess the potential of these startup? Because like you said, you are sector and you are geographic agnostic. So how do you assess the potential of these startup? Because they are so different from each other.
• And how do you place a high value on any factor on these startups, you mentioned about team, traction a little bit, but what is more important for you as an angel. Is the team, Is the traction, it’s a market? And do you have any special requirement for mobility and logistics startup, because it’s a podcast for mobility companies. So, I just want to understand, do you have any special requirement for mobility companies or logistic companies?

Ashley L. Flucas [20:04]:

Yeah, that’s a great question. And I’ll, I guess I’ll probably take it a bit backwards. Mobility, you know, I had mentioned that like something like biotech or like deep-tech or things that kind of have a different framework of evaluating, I would actually make, maybe make the same argument around mobility as well, because of course you can look at things like distribution for, but that’s going to be more in mobility. That’s going to be more of a mature company anyway, which is a different type of analysis. Yeah, for me, more mobility is a heavy emphasis on team. And so you know, preferably even, you know, if it’s not a repeat founder, I mean, folks that have worked within the space and sort of the best of the best types of you know, organizations.

Ashley L. Flucas [21:00]:

And so, you know, I take one that I had, for example you know XOS trucks. It was one of the founders was XOS past experience. So I was like, you know, like, it’s those types of things. Or, and I look for besides the team, I also really look at what are they doing even early from a partnership standpoint, or what do they have the ability to do for a partnership standpoint to a degree in this sector? I think that is that also kind of gets, I guess, at my distribution standpoint. So I look at something like LOI, right? And when I invested in them, they were, it was very early on, but they had secured those partnership with Walmart. I’m like doing that at your stage. Like that really tells me something about who you are as a team.

Ashley L. Flucas [21:50]:

It tells me something beyond even what I can read about the, you know, the potential promise and magnitude of your technology. And so if I went down the list and, and looked at each of the kind of mobility startups I think they would all have that commonality where the founders are absolutely top tier technical experts, deep experience, where they’ve very early on established that they can win kind of top partnerships. And then the other factor is obviously it goes without saying, you know, it’s a massive, massive, massive market. So that’s, so it’s like never really the concern there, but even more so than other sectors, it’s like, what are you doing? That’s really different because it’s also a super saturated market. It’s not like there aren’t a million truck and tire and transportation, you know, companies, you know, from older companies to news.

Ashley L. Flucas [22:53]:

So it’s like, what is your insight that no one else is seeing? Or what is your technological moat that no one else has. And that, and that’s really key, you know, like if you just come to me and you’re doing a bus start, okay, okay. That’s, that’s going to do anything or slightly better than the gray like that. It’s not, you can’t do the incremental improvement. It can’t just be marketing. It has to be a step function change. Yeah. Potentially. And so that that’s really a focus when it comes to that sector.

Jaspal Singh [23:31]:

No, that’s a great point. You mentioned about the partnership because now I can also relate because I see a lot of mobility startup and all, and partnership is a key, it’s a B2B kind of a segment. So you really need to have those kind of partnership to go ahead. Gatik is another story because they have a very unique segment of warehouse to warehouse driverless. And Walmart is the best partner because they have so many warehouses and, and they can expand so quickly world over. If it’s successful in the US, they can quickly successfully go world over. Now, I really like your point about this partnership and the technology mode and probably I will use the same function now to evaluate some of these companies.

Now, my next question, which you touch already a little bit, there was plenty of money available in the market, or I should say it’s now becoming less and less, but at the same time, there are many more founders and entrepreneur who are working on new idea every day.

Jaspal Singh [24:25]:

You must be seeing new pitches, new ideas, and all. So do you think that job of an investor and capital allocator is becoming easier or more difficult? Because when you’re getting more idea, should I say the job is becoming easier because now you can pick a plenty. And second is what is your suggestion for the first-time founder? Because like you mentioned, if it’s a repeated founder, the, the story is easy. You can easily create your story. You can easily tell people what you’re doing, but for first time founder who are raising the external funding for the first time, they always face this challenge of how should they start? Where should they reach what process they should follow?

Ashley L. Flucas [25:03]:

Yeah. On the first point in, in terms of, is it easier? I guess it kind, it depends on the position you’re in, right. So speaking from the perspective a non- fund perspective as long as, you know, you yourself are, are comfortable investing, or you can marshal your group of folks to invest. I would say yes, because the opportunities in the inbound are only going to tick up from here as funds begin to retreat a little or elongate their processes just as I saw within COVID, if you’re fund. You know, there may be some difficulty because I think, you know, LPs are going to be a little more, a little bit more active..

Ashley L. Flucas [25:49]:

Than they’re going to be answering for different things within the portfolio. But I mean, I think the opportunities are going to be more robust for sure. So long as you actually have, you know, the powder to be able to do it. So it’ll be, it’ll be an interesting time for sure. Yeah.

And then you were, I guess, asking about first-time founders. Yeah, no, I mean, it’s a great question. You know, like I said for sure have backed plenty of first-time founders for me. It’s always really nice if you, of course, if someone can back a repeat founder, but more often than not, I’m backing you know, first time founders. And at the end of the day of a founder can show me that they understand you know, have insight into the things that I most care about depending on the sector then I’m good with that.

Ashley L. Flucas [26:50]:

And so it goes back to the conversation that we were just having at the end of the day, if you show me that you understand distribution, if you show me that with your background, with your network that you can get into enterprises or that you can, you know, have these partnerships, or you show me from a technical standpoint, you know, what you’ve done from a patent perspective, from a portfolio, you know, speaking of logistics, and I’m going to be that I’m going to be comfortable. But it’s about going in and understanding for your sector, kind of what those key aspects are, and being well prepared to kind of address those. And so, you know, at the end of the day, this market is going to be tough for everyone. Of course, you know, it’s things are always going to be a bit easier for repeat founders. But even they, I think both may have more to answer to if they’re repeat but doing something that’s wholesale different from whatever. Yeah. They are originally you know, what they originally did.

Jaspal Singh [27:55]:

Yeah, no that’s true. It’s the market is tough for everybody. It doesn’t matter whether you’re first time or second, if you’re doing a completely different job. So you invest end of the day will ask question, which are basic “what is your product market” and “how will you’re going to make money or not?”

And, and now my next question is actually about how to be ready for investor and sending their pitch decks and all. So you must be receiving thousands of pitch deck every month. In fact, I send you a lot of them, and sometimes you say no because some of them are not good or some of the ideas are not good. So I’m curious to learn how you evaluate Pitch decks because it’s just a short document to create an impression with an investor.

And what are the top five thing, which are a kind of a must in a good pitch deck because people, I see a lot of Pitch decks, they have 20 slides to hundred slides, but what are the top five things they should include and which can create impression on the investor?

Ashley L. Flucas [28:56]:

Yeah, so I have seen pitch decks from feels like from two slides to a hundreds, all different formats and colors, but I mean, for me, and it’s really interesting, particularly if it’s a company that’s not necessarily coming in warm intro either, and you’re trying to make it a sense because, you can’t get on the phone with everyone who comes in. And so you’re looking at a few slides and making a determination if something is worth escalating. But for me you know, there’s a few things, not that they’re necessarily in every pitch, but, I know things that will grab my attention.

Number one is like I said, is a bit less like concern for mobility, but in general, TAM (Total Addressable Market) and so, and not everyone, I mean, typically has TAM slide, but I get a little more granular in the sense, like I want to go through from every pitch deck, having a very clear view of how they’re going to reach a hundred million in revenue.

Ashley L. Flucas [30:04]:

Why, because bull or bear market, that’s pretty much the benchmark to knowing that this is a potential unicorn type of company, irrespective of industry and multiple. And so bonus points to the startups who actually spell that out. But if they haven’t spelled it out, if they’ve done enough on kind of the unit economics, the obtainable market and do their ideal customer profile is then I can do that myself back of the napkin, but I was like, I need to do. I need to every deck for me to take it to the next level. I need to understand how you get there right away, because that’s, that’s going to be a major thumbs up or thumbs down for me. If I look at your kind of individual unit economics and I say, okay, it would take X number of units or X number of contracts, or X number of LOIs to get there.

Ashley L. Flucas [30:58]:

And I asked myself like, how, just from what I know of the industry in general, how realistic or not is that, or this company would have to be like the most profound outlier to possibly get the penetration to get there. Then it’s a no for me. If I do the math and I’m like, yeah, I actually think the product and all of that is together. They have a really good shot of getting there and it doesn’t really actually take a lot in the grand scheme of things to get there. Then that’s something that I get excited about. So that’s number one second. Obviously not to be the de a dead horse, but if they get into, you know, explaining a bit more or like really focus, showing what they’re going to do from a go-to-market perspective.

Ashley L. Flucas [31:45]:

And so for me, that’s essential. I want to know not just who you’re targeting, but how and if that is clear to me like that hasn’t been thought out then that’s going to be less compelling to me. And for me, those are the two most critical points. Everything else is I think is a bit standard.

Of course, I would love to know about your competition. Maybe that’s third, because I want to know not that I’m would be deterred by competition, but I want to know how well you understand the landscape and so what you’re doing to differentiate, etc., and then everything else though. I think it’s kind of you know, boiler plate, of course I want to know about the team and all that good stuff. But for me, those are, those are kind of the main points.

Jaspal Singh [32:40]:

All these are great points. The time and the market sizing, the go-to-market, the competition, because a lot of time founder doesn’t even understand what is the competition? I mean, they say, there is no competition, which is like a big scary thing. If any founder tell me there is no competition, I tell them, okay, let’s wait for the competition to come to start, because it cannot be that there cannot be any competition. So thank you for sharing this.

And, and I think people who are listening, who are properly reach out to you later, will make sure they have these key components in this slide deck to get your attention. Like I mentioned there is plenty of money available in the market. If you have a good idea. So even today, even when people are skeptical about investment and all, but I’m still seeing companies are raising more than $100 million of fund.

But the founders are not only looking purely for money anymore. I mean, the good founder looks for kind of a strategic value. What are the key points that founders should look for while taking invest board? I remember in your portfolio, you invested in some of the company, not because of the value point of view, but because of the strategic value you can bring to those founders and all. What are the thing the founders should look when they bring an investment on board?

Ashley L. Flucas [33:56]:

Yeah, that’s a great question. You know, one question that I’ll ask a lot about founder from founders, particularly at the early stage as I will ask them how they’re thinking about their own round composition, because it gives me some insight into their thinking and the kind of company that they want to build, because my advice is you’re actually not looking for the same thing in every investor is you should be, you should be building a team that has different strengths. And so same things are cut and dry. Like, do you potentially want a fund board who has deep pockets and who can continue to invest with you? Sure. That’s great. Find that someone who can do that. Do you want folks who are, you know, potentially industry expert? You want folks who potentially go-to-market expert.

Ashley L. Flucas [34:44]:

You want people who just potentially have a really wide network and how can help you with like customer acquisition and, hiring and that kind of thing. And so, when I look at it as like, you don’t want the same thing from every person, but what you want to do is walk away from every person understanding what their superpower is. And you want to build together a team of folks with different superpowers, because, you know, I don’t know if you’ve got 10 people on your cap table, or why would you want all 10 of them being able to offer you the same thing?

I think you want different voices and you also want potentially some folks who are going to challenge you because they think differently than in, and everything is not necessarily a consensus. That doesn’t mean you can do that, obviously at a collegial enjoy working with them type of way. So no jerks, but you know, that would be my advice.

Jaspal Singh [35:39]:

That’s a great advice. It’s like building a team. So in a building a team, you need founders or co-founder with the complementary skill, not having all the same skills. So I think it’s like when you take investor on board, you also need to make sure that some investors can help you on the client side, but some can help you for the product side and some can have a deep pocket and all. That’s a great point.

Now I want to like to discuss with you about the Web3 and Blockchain, and you haven’t invested in many startups in that space as of now. And I would say in your portfolio, there are only seven company in that space. You have invested, but it’s growing. And I think crypto and Web3 is the best performing portfolio on the AngelList with doubled growth in last two year. There is a crazy amount of money and funding going into that space. What do you think about these technologies and how do you envision these technologies can be used in our life? Because there are a lot of this buzz about Boring Ape and the Stone and the Rock selling for millions, but what exactly you see these technology can be used in our life?

Ashley L. Flucas [36:45]:

Yeah. I mean, that’s the thing for me and, for right now, why it’s not I think it’s exciting. It’s not a huge part of my portfolio because I think that’s what we’re still finding out. Right. And so for me you know, a lot of my plays in this space, I guess have been a little bit of picks and shovels and kind of enabling technologies because I think to some degrees, we still don’t really know what those usecases would be. I have seen some interesting applications PropTech, like, you know, putting, you know, using NFTs to sell a property. Like that’s really cool. We might, I think we saw a long way away from that being a common type of thing, but there are tons of interesting applications. But that’s why for me, I’m more focused on the enabling stuff because there’s also just you know, there’s so much out there there’s so much that’s hype based and that doesn’t actually have any form of utility and that’s speculative.

Ashley L. Flucas [37:42]:

And to your point, you know, on something like AngelList, like right now, or over the last year, that category by far commands the most attention and fundraising and, maybe even the markups, but I think a lot of it is going to end up being paper tigers. So you know, at the end of the day markups mean nothing only exits do. So yeah, you might get in a hot whatever Crypto, whatever company it gets, somebody comes in across over fund and marks it up or whatever. But that, to me, that’s really meaningless until we see where you exit, especially in this market. And so, you know like I said, I think it’s all exciting. And in the coming years, you’re going to see the folks who build compelling use cases and separate from the pack but just the sheer volume of money going into it doesn’t even support enterprise value. That’s going to make that something that works for me works for everyone. So, like I said, my view is like I said, I really focus on enabling and kind of ecosystem technologies until we can kind of see, like, who are the people who are building things that have true utility that have staying power. And, and I think that will emerge. I just don’t think it’s really clear right now.

Jaspal Singh [39:09]:

I agree with you. There are a lot of speculation going on. In fact, I know a couple of good startup, which are trying to build product in mobility space. But it’s still a very speculative market and we don’t know what the end use cases of these companies and all will be.

Now my next question is, and actually you are, it’s very close to your heart because you’re a big advocate of more representation of historically underrepresented group in the tech and the investment space. And do you want to share a little bit about your mission and why do you believe it’s critical for the future growth?

Ashley L. Flucas [39:40]:

Yeah, so I think it also is kind of similar to the, the philosophy when I was just kind of talking about when even we were talking about founders building teams in my view, products, services, ideas are better, the more voices that you have adding to that. And so that aligns very much with diversity. And so in my view, you know, I obviously, I believe in backing diverse startups, but at the end of the day, I invest in startups based on, you know, just the, the fundamentals though. I think if that’s all you’re looking at, you will actually find that your portfolio is I has diverse founders if you don’t have those, that kind of pattern matching and bias, but by the same token and my kind of syndicate style of investing I’m actually, you know, are probably even more focused on you know, allowing access to diverse investors from ethnicity, from gender, from geography all of the above.

Ashley L. Flucas [40:46]:

I mean, all are kind of welcome when it comes to my syndicate, if they’re going to contribute and, be good members with the thought of what better way to kind of you know, potentially create generational wealth by distributing in that way and democratizing access into historically underrepresented folks. And then being able to bring more voices into venture and give people track records to be able to do something similar and, be cheque writers. Because cheque writers matter because they determine who gets funded. And that can kind of also feed up into you know, more diverse founders being supported. So, you know, it definitely really important to me, but like I said, not even just for the sake of it that you could argue, it’s still worthwhile just for the sake of it.

Ashley L. Flucas [41:41]:

But I mean, I think it genuinely contributes to better ideas and better companies. And I know myself, even when I speak with, or advise founder. The founder did a number of times they’ll tell me something like no other investor has actually asked that. And for me, it may sound like common in my view, common sense, but I think it comes from the fact that, I don’t have a traditional venture background in terms of even my experience. You know, when I first started getting going, there was no ecosystem in Florida, like the way there is now. And then of course just my own kind of life experience from being a woman of color and all of those feeds into, how I think and my life experience and what I contribute. And so I like to think if you can do that in a robust way that’s just going to help everyone.

Jaspal Singh [42:38]:

Well, thank you for sharing. It’s a great mission you have, and I agree with you, it’s not only diversity for the investor, but also for the founder, for the team. It’s always work. So it’s always bring new skills, new knowledge and new things.

Now, you mentioned this point earlier, and I just want to go a little deeper into that to understand what the future of the zoom call is? We see investment right now in your investment portfolio, you have 20% of companies invested in Africa and Southeast Asia. And I’m pretty sure you must have, like, you have never met them in person. Like you just had a zoom call and invested in them. So pandemic, that was big things happen during the pandemic. Like everything shifted to zoom and people start writing cheque over the zoom, but do you think this trend will continue? And what’s your prediction for the ecosystem of startup in those regions because they got a lot of funding during this period of COVID and pandemic and all. Will it continue or will you see some slow down the deal happening over zoom and in this region?

Ashley L. Flucas [43:45]:

Yeah, I think it’s going to continue. I mean, you might see, I think there will be, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle, like it’s some of the hub cities or, newly formed hub, like Miami, you’ll see more you’ll see more in person, but I don’t think zoom investing is going away, especially, you know, in, in all of those geographies that you mentioned. You’re seeing more and more global VC interests and, you know, it’s just more kind of practical to do it that way. And just because of the way companies are company building, right? So, you know, a lot of companies are going in remote first and, and distributed teams, etc. And so I think, VCs will have to continue to adapt to that. And I think the approach maybe you know, I could even see because folks are used to it. Maybe it’s zoom first. And then we meet in person as a way to initially screen it. But I don’t think that aspect of things is going away anytime soon necessarily.

Jaspal Singh [44:56]:

I agree with your point, actually, the truth is in the middle. So we will not see those historical record funding so that the funding will slow down a bit. But at the same time, it’ll not be very low. So people will continue to invest in these geography because the ecosystem is growing and the new companies and new models are emerging.

And all now the point which you cover a little bit in the beginning is about this funding. Funding Winter is coming and, and the market is going through some changes. And like you said, the VCs are holding back the money. A lot of VCs are not even investing. There was a recent data which say there are $250 billion of dry powder available with the VCs. So it’s a quarter a trillion money, which is with the VC. They are not investing because they’re not right now sure about how the market will work.

What are your views on this the funding winter? And what is your advice for the founders? Are you giving any special advice to the founders, which are in your portfolio or your meeting how you see the future coming?

Ashley L. Flucas [46:00]:

Yeah, so like I said, you know, this moment we’re in may last longer than what we experienced with COVID, but I still think there are similar lessons, right? I mean, at the end of the day, a lot of VCs are taking pause, but to your point, I still look at the fact that there is a ton of dry powder and, they make their money on deploying that and management fees. And so they’re not just going to sit on that forever. So at the end of the day, you know, this summer maybe even through the end of this year is going to probably be of shock to the system. But at some point, they’re going to get back to deploying capital. It’s just going to be a bit more orderly than it was than it was before.

Ashley L. Flucas [46:47]:

And so for founders I think, you know, patience is key. Discipline is key and, existing companies it’s about being default alive, right? So taking stock take, looking at your burn, all of that good stuff and making sure you’ve got enough of war chest to ideally go through the next 24 months if you had to and you know, the feelings that were in the air 6 or 9 months ago, where you’re waiting on all these competing term sheets, and you’re basically deciding based of, who’s going to give you the most ridiculous valuation. You’ve got to put that to the side. You got to be a little less concerned about your dilution and caps and be worried about just getting the money that you need to hunker down and build what you’re building. And if you have that mentality, I think you’ll be fine.

Jaspal Singh [47:48]:

Yeah, that’s a great point about having a runway for at least 24 months, if you have less there is a high chance that the plane will crash, or the startup will shut down. So, you need to have a long runway and reduce your bond rate. A lot of startups have increased the burned rate and all, but we are already seeing, there are a lot of layoff are happening. And the reason for that is people want to reduce their burnout.

So this is my last question, and it’s basically about angel investment. So angel investment is a risky space at the same time. Like you mentioned, it’s a very interesting space to build knowledge and wealth. What is your advice to someone who is new in this investing space and want to become an angel investor? How can an early-stage angel investor establish credibility in this space? What is your advice for people who are just looking to enter this market now?

Ashley L. Flucas [48:38]:

Yeah, so great question. I mean, for me, and, and maybe you can attest to the same, you know, probably the most impactful thing that I did starting out was joining AngelList because it was an opportunity to meet other like-minded folks who are kind of you know, being a part of the same journey. It’ an opportunity to sit back in, at least to start, if you want in a passive way and see tons of deal flow, really dive in, understand market trends, be able to read decks and memos, and understand dynamics and really just learn and in, with kind of the training wheels on. And so for me, that’s a pretty powerful way to do that. And then in the meantime be doing what you can to network because, you know, one thing I think I always say is that, you know, there’s a fair amount of luck involved in this space.

Ashley L. Flucas [49:41]:

And I don’t think the people who win are just necessarily so much are materially smarter than other folks. What I do think they have is access. And so you’ve got to do what you can on your end to make sure you are seeing as many deals as possible. So I said, AngelList is one tool to do that, but the other is this good old fashioned network, joining angel groups, joining take fellowships, whatever it is to build that network because you probably whoever you are out there, you’re probably smart enough to, or whatever you could probably invest in the next Uber, but it really won’t matter if you’re not invited to invest.

And so that’s my first big piece of advice, get as knowledgeable as you can and do everything you can to make sure you have the most robust deal flow possible. And then, you know, my own personal advice, like, which I said has been brought out for me, like I said, is the indexing and, being diverse and, giving yourself more shots on goal to be able to kind of get the big hit that makes a difference in your portfolio.

Jaspal Singh [50:53]:

That’s true. It’s actually, you need to be at the right time at the right place for the luck to happen. So if you are not there, if you’re not listening to Uber pitch, and if you’re not investing, you cannot make money from that company. You have to be there.

Thank you so much, Ashley, we learned so much about angel investment, your thesis and how you invest, and, and a lot of lessons for the founder and all.

In the last, we have this Rapid-fire around and I personally put this because I want to understand more Ashley as a person, rather than just as an investor or lawyer. So we ask five questions and you need to just answer them quickly, whatever comes to your mind. So, if you’re ready, I’ll just fire away.

Ashley L. Flucas [51:31]:

Lawyers. Aren’t good with that, but I’ll do

Jaspal Singh [51:34]:

We have to think through everything. Yeah. You need time to think, but that’s why we have this interesting round, not giving any time to think.

So my first question is, if you are, if you are not in law or investment space, what other profession you would’ve selected?

Ashley L. Flucas [51:49]:

Oh, man, I am growing up, I wanted to be a host on the travel channel

Jaspal Singh [51:54]:

Host on the travel channel. That’s an interesting profession, I would say so the travel startup, or the founder who are investing in travel company, they should reach out to you.

So my second question is you travel so much around the world. In fact, you live outside for some time, which is your favorite city in the world?

Ashley L. Flucas [52:22]:

Favorite city in the world would be Paris.

Jaspal Singh [52:27]:

Paris. And how often you been there? Like how many times you’ve been there?

Ashley L. Flucas [52:32]:

Oh, God. I mean, definitely more than 10. It was much easier when I was living in London, but even now I think the last few years. I make it there about you know, I’ve been going there about once a year, at least over the past couple of years. And I’ll be there again in August.

Jaspal Singh [52:49]:

Oh man. That’s, that’s definitely your favorite city, 10 times. So definitely it’s a lovely city I’ve been there. So I know it’s a lovely city.

Your favorite startup in the mobility and logistics sector and why or any other sector.

Ashley L. Flucas [53:04]:

And then I got to like call all to mind. You know, I don’t how it’ll turn out, but may maybe Wayve based out of the UK. Right. I’m really just intrigued by them because they’re one of those ones, which is what I called out for this sector. That’s going right. When everybody is going left. So, you know, in terms of autonomous driving, obviously a lot of folks are going after that, but, you know they, they kind of had a totally different way of looking at it in a true kind of machine learning, as opposed to like LIDAR and maps approach. And so, I mean, they could spectacularly fail, but it’s really interesting that they went about it that way. So that’s one of the startups that I’m most intrigued by. Right. And then also, because obviously whoever is right in that space is going to be in the fortune 10. So, oh yeah.

Jaspal Singh [54:07]:

So whosoever will be right, because there are so many of them, but it’s like, which one will be, right.

My next question is what are your, what are you most excited about this or next year?

Ashley L. Flucas [54:21]:

This year, I’m always that’s just my personality. I’m always more excited about the present. That’s have, that’s have control over.

Jaspal Singh [54:32]:

Okay. And anything which you like about this year you want to do this year, like you want to achieve in this year.

Ashley L. Flucas [54:40]:

Yeah. So you know, I think for me personally, like the last two years, particularly with COVID, I was just like a maniac burning myself out, trying to build this syndicate and, build everything and building networking. So I actually looking forward to actually getting back to having a balanced life and doing some more traveling etc. and then also being able to do deals in a different type of pace and environment. It’s a new challenge, new opportunity.

Jaspal Singh [55:19]:

Okay. That’s a great point. And I, I wish you safe travel because I know you’re traveling this week as well, so have a safe travel.

My next and last question is if you can change one thing in your life, what would it be?

Ashley L. Flucas [55:32]:

Nothing.

Jaspal Singh [55:33]:

Nothing.

Ashley L. Flucas [55:35]:

Yeah. I don’t know many people feel that way, but, you know, I’m like a butterfly effect person, right. Is that any change that you ever go back and make, could completely change kind of where you are now? And I feel good about where I am personally, professionally in all of it. So I’m no regret kind of person.

Jaspal Singh [55:58]:

That’s great. No, I love that answer. And in fact, the people who are happy, what they found their passion give the same answer. If you find what you’re doing is meaningful to the world and to yourself, you always love what you are, what you have achieved in life.

So thank you so much, Ashley for your great insight. I really love this conversation with you and learn a lot from your experience. In fact, we had conversation earlier, but today conversation helped me to know a little more about yourself.

Ashley L. Flucas [56:28]:

Yeah no problem at all. Thanks for having me. And, and thanks for your, if not day, pretty close to day one support of the syndicate. So definitely appreciate that.